Gretl hopes and believes that there will be no repetition of experiences like the Holocaust of the 1940s

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INT: When you look ahead or you see something now, about any kind of prosecution ehm persecution do you get extremely upset about it? Are you moved to do something about it?

G.S: Well I get upset about it but I haven't joined any groups or anything to do anything about it. I suppose I should.

INT: I just wondered if perhaps an experience like that would make you fear that it could happen anywhere - do you think it could?

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G.S: Well I think the Germans are a particular lot of people. I don't know. I hope that it couldn't happen like that anymore, I don't think it could. That you can kill six million people, you know? It's systematically so well organised, so cold bloodedly. It's not, I mean, I can understand a pilot dropping a few bombs, I can understand that. Because he doesn't actually see what happens to each individual person that he kills. But to go and torture and, you know, skin people, that kind of thing is.it's unbelievable that human beings can do this to one another. I, I just, I can't really, I can't really describe it.

INT: For your own children and your grandchildren now, some growing up in France, some growing up here - what do you want for them?

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G.S: Well I just want them to be happy. I think that, it gives me great joy to find that I have in fact five grandsons and I sort of feel, every time something like that happens I say one in the eye for Hitler, you know. Because, you know. And I now even have a Jewish name - Shapiro, you know. And there are three new Shapiros! Which is wonderful!

INT: One last question. What do you think you missed in your childhood? Apart from having mum and dad, do you think that your aunt managed to make up for most things?

G.S: I think she did make up for most things. Perhaps the only thing - I think our household was more musical.

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I mean, there was more music in it, but that's about it. But that, you see, a lot of the childhood I spent in school really, so it wasn't so much lacking. I think I had a very happy childhood as far as, you know, one can without one's mother

INT: That's lovely

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